Elektron-Users

Jyoti wrote:

FWIW, I'm self-taught in synthesis: I got a Rogue, started twiddling and, eventually, read a couple of books on synthesis. But if I had gone straight for the books, it would have put me off. I'll have a dig around and see if I can find any book resources for you - the web stuff you know already, innit?



I've seen a bunch of stuff on the web... and read a few things that are specific to synth I don't own. I was looking for some stuff like eminor9 gave me above (thanks eminor )... something I can try on one of my synths...then go from there. I would love to know some good books. I'm not trying to be a pain in the ass...I'm just trying to learn in a practical way. Tweaking blindly is cool...but sometimes you just want a certain sound and it is good to know how to get it. I think my personal definition of a pad and a string sound might be too simple. I'm not looking for chords of billions of sounds stacked on top of each other (the orchestra effect)...just some simple back round stuff.

mos6581 wrote:

Whats even more important is that YOU feel satisfied with what you have created. Sharing your music takes courage, especially if you have set high standards for yourself. People may not like everything you do but it only takes one hit to make a one hit wonder, right?

I liked that rap song you shared some time ago btw.

/Andreas

true. and thanks.

jsrockit wrote:
I will post a few songs here...but they are rap songs and are very minimal. Everyone here seems to be more interested in tweaks per second and high BPMs in their stuff...I tend to let a beat ride in my stuff and it is slower...may be a bit too boring for this group.

This is the stuff I find myself programming more and more on my MD--that is, slow and steady. Steady illin! But seriously, there are definitely variances in taste and style on this forum, which is a good thing. Personally, I wouldn't be too strusfrated. I don't like everyone's style on this forum, and I'm sure others will say the same thing. I just try to learn what I can, where I can. Shit, man. I just have fun programming a beat that makes me get the fuck up out of my seat!

XOXOX

cchocjr wrote:
Shit, man. I just have fun programming a beat that makes me get the fuck up out of my seat!

XOXOX

Yeah, or one to make me sit down and relax...

I know alot of people don't like it but I think it is a wonderful cheap synth, The korg MS2000. You can get them cheaper than a micron, I'm sure. They are DSP based. The original thing about them is the modulation sequencer. They can make good pads that cut through mixes quite well. Some people don't like it, but there are many dedicated users that love them.

I think pads are abviously slow attack long release. The other thing to do is tune osc up or down 12 semitones, 5 and 7 semitones, and detuning oscs. I like to add noise and other LFO destinations.

Either way.

ok JS, I have a few thoughts on this subject...

- in addition to the tips already listed, remember to think about the frequency content of your pad sounds. IMO this is as important as the volume envelope. A pad is usually used to "pad out" or fill out the spectrum in respect to the other elements in your track. So you probably don't want too much bass going on in your pad patches, or else you'll clash with the bassline. Stuff like that. And for what it is worth, some of my favorite pad sounds that I've made don't follow the "slow attack, long release" formula...but closer in shape to an organ envelope (instant on, full sustain, instant off). This calls for a different approach to sequencing the sound, as well.

- I don't want to make you feel defensive, but sometimes I think you should change the way you approach programming, from a mental perspective. I see you make quite a few topics about new synth releases, which synth to buy next, boutique effects boxes, etc...there is nothing wrong with collecting gear that you like, but I get the feeling that if you devoted as much effort to learning the synths you already have as you do to hunting down new stuff to buy, you might already know how to program some killer pads....especially since you already own the monomachine and the evolver! Please take this as sincere advice and not as a personal attack. I've been in the spot where I thought getting X polyphony or Y modulation feature was gonna make me a better programmer, and I got over it by just remembering how much sound you can get out of a guitar. It's the oldest truism in this game, but it's still true: it's not the gear, it's the musician.

- in the same vein: it would behoove you to just get in there and tweak...you don't need (or want) a recipe for making sounds. If you accidentally do something that you're not supposed to...sample it, remap it, effect it, and use it as a brand new sound source. If you go and ask on forums like this, how do I make a string sound? You get the standard recipe for the string sound that everybody with a synth has tried. If you are interested in forging your own style, there is no way to accomplish that other than learning the synth on your own terms, and superimposing each synth's parameter matrix on your own system of cognitive machinery.

- judging from your description of your sparse hip hop style, I'd love to check some of your stuff. Like somebody already said in this topic, it takes a lot of courage to post something...so select the best and put it up there man!



---- G

ggoodwin wrote:
If you go and ask on forums like this, how do I make a string sound? You get the standard recipe for the string sound that everybody with a synth has tried. If you are interested in forging your own style, there is no way to accomplish that other than learning the synth on your own terms, and superimposing each synth's parameter matrix on your own system of cognitive machinery.
---- G

True. And yet, on the other hand, many 'masters' in visual and literary arts achieved their level of mastery by first copying the existing work/technique of their predecessors. Some of my favorite stuff has been accomplished by just noodling around. Then again, when I have a sound in mind that I want to achieve, and I can't get it right because I don't know what I'm 'supposed' to do, I feel pretty frustrated. What I'm suggesting is the more traditional 'master the basics...learn them inside and out, in order to move 'beyond'' approach. In other words, I've found it often the case that before I'm able to successfully break the rules, I must first understand them. And on the other, other hand, ggoodwin, your comments about the propensity for some folks (myself included, to a shameful extent) to look for the solution to their problem in other gear are certainly true. Whether or not they have any bearing on Mr. rockit's dilemma, I will not venture. But it certainly is something that happens to me.

I take no offense to the learning what I have stuff...and it is no secret that I am a gear whore of sorts... However, I have the money now due to massive overtime...and will be unemployed in 24 days. Once unemployed...I will spend alot of time with my equipment. I do spend an hour or two every day now...but alot of it has been spent doing vocals, finishing old tracks. Once I finish the songs I'm working on... I will start using my other equipment full on. I do know how to use the MnM and MD. The Sid is not my thing...since I don't like programming it really. The Evolver is great...but I am only in the beginning stages of using that. I think I just bought too much at once and am trying to learn it all at once. Plus, I want to expand my usual types of sounds. To tell you the truth. I could make everything on the MPC I have...since I understand how to use samples and how to blend them and have been working that way for years. But after getting the Monomachine, I found that I like synths and wouldn't mind doing songs without samples as well. I used synth for bass always...but never for anything else...so now I'm learning. I guess I just come off as a complete idiot who doesn't know how to even make a song...but owns too much equipment. I can assure you that I know how to make a song...but just want to expand the way I do things. I understand that it is VCO to VCA to VCF to Envelope etc...but within those are tons of sound possibilites...and alot of room for error or happy accidents. Sometimes it is better to ask someone...get the tried and true way...and then make it your own....which is why I do not mind getting generic examples of strings and pads. By the way, alot of songs on the radio use presets from the Triton and others...and they are fine with that. I'm not. I'll use samples if I want to use an existing sound. The reason I am trying to learn about synths is so I can make my own sounds...or I would just stick to sampling.

This is the way things have worked for me:

1. Empty machine
When I get new gear, I listen the presets once (sometimes don't even do that as in case of MD) and then empty the machine. From now on it's going to be _my individual_ machine. Nobody else is going to make the same patches. Making the patch and saving it investing for the future. I might find way to use it (if I make sure that everything I make has been for serious).

2. 'I can make it with any gear' -attitude
'I can make it with any gear' -attitude doesn't mean I could benefit from having loads of gear. It is quite opposite; it means you will only need one piece of gear to do your stuff. Autechre once said that they don't care about gear, they can do interesting stuff with any gear. I love this attitude. So focus on the 'one machine' (sell the rest).

3. Understanding of concept of good
Good hasn't anything to do with the price of the gear, features, genrestyles or material at all (forget the fattness and analogue). Good lives inside human minds. It transmits through concept of beauty. So learing to do good stuff is learning about how you relate to the world. Think outside of box you normally live. What I'm trying to say that there isn't any universal synth basics, its more of a path one need to walk and it can happen only by tweaking the thing and making it your own tweaking habits.

4. Keep your desk clean
I read this from somewhere as an advice for starting musician (which I am myself too). I think it perfectly captures my idea of how I like to approach the thing. So clean your desk, set your MnM to it and start to do pads on a regular basis. It will come. (Try to layering tracks on a MnM.)